TheRealityCheckmate_E02_2026-01-19

[00:00:00]

This is the Reality Checkmate podcast.

Garrett: We're two reality nerds

Britney: who break down

Garrett: stratagem

Britney: and psyche.

Intro and Arrival

Britney: Welcome everyone. We are dissecting Traitors US season four, episode one. So excited that Traitors is back and looks like it's gonna be bigger and better.

Garrett: It's gonna be an interesting and exciting and crazy season already.

Britney: Crazy season already. I thought, well, first off, I thought it was so cool that they arrived at night.

That was different, and with the fireworks and stuff, it just added to the drama and theatrics and the production of it all, and I think that was so cool. But there was actually a lot that went on inside the cars that I picked up on, like upon arrival even. I saw some of the players already starting to play the game -- [00:01:00] even before it started.

Garrett: Yeah, so I did as well. Uh, especially, uh, Yam Yam and Candiace were in that first car and Yam Yam was talking about how he was, or he thought that it would be easier as a faithful to play the game, the long game to be in there a long time. And so, um, but, but then we learned later that he really wants to be a traitor.

Britney: Do you think that was him planting seeds to the other players in the car saying, Hey, I don't want to be a traitor. I wanna be a faithful and kind of get ... eyes off of him?

Garrett: Yeah, I think so. I mean, if I was in that situation, I would definitely, no matter what before I know if I'm a traitor, I want everybody to think I'm a faithful no matter what.

I'll always be a faithful and that's what I want. Um, I mean, you don't tell anybody, Hey, I wanna be a traitor coming into this. That wouldn't go down well because then they're like, well, you seem suspicious. Right, [00:02:00] right. Yeah. You don't tell people that. I don't think, um, I don't know if anybody's ever done it, but

Britney: If they were smart, they wouldn't,

Garrett: yeah. I don't think they would go well.

Um, and Candiace did something similar. She said, I'm just too real to be a traitor.

Britney: Yes. Yeah. So I, I took that as she speaks, her mind speaks what's on her mind.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: And when you're a traitor or faithful, that's not always super smart because if you're real all the time, you wanna keep your cards close to your chest and not bring attention to yourself.

So I don't see people who, they wanna play an honest game. They wanna play a real game. They don't wanna change who they are. That's not really a good strategy in my personal opinion.

Garrett: Do you think it is true that Candiace is, um, too real?

Britney: Oh [00:03:00] gosh, I have no idea..

Well, actually seeing this first episode, no.

Garrett: She, she's definitely real, but in different ways.

I

Britney: mean, we'll, we'll get into it, but is it real If you're lying?

Garrett: Right. She's definitely authentically herself. That's, I think that's that we can definitely say. She's real that way for sure. Um, all right. What about Donna? You get to see her in the car as well. What your thoughts about what she did or do you want me to...

Britney: oh, I was excited for her and we got to see more of, just a little bit of that. She's ready to play. She wants to play the game and she doesn't wanna sit and twiddle her thumbs.

Garrett: Yeah. She, we kind of pointed it out in our preview how she might come across as or be thought of as the sweet old grandma kind of thing. And she acknowledged that actually as well, [00:04:00] so that she can, she sees that people might think of her as that way, but that they're not gonna see what's coming for them, she said.

And so, uh, I think there is some. Some interesting insight there about who she may be and how she might be playing this game.

Britney: I hope she's picked for a traitor and hope she pulls it off and we get to see that from her.

Garrett: Yeah. That would be really interesting if she's not already....

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Part of that group, which we'll get to later. Um, and then Rob C...

Britney: mm-hmm.

Garrett: Who says that he's one of, he says, I want to flip this cat and mouse game on its head. What do you think he's talking about? What is he gonna do?

Britney: Well, again. He's there to play. He's there to figure out whether he is, um, a traitor or a faithful. He is going to be the best traitor. He's going to be the best faithful, and that's kind of what I took that.

Garrett: Yeah. And he definitely brings more, um, strategic thinking.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: [00:05:00] Multi-level thinking and, um. Knowledge of gameplay than a lot of the other players. Um,

Britney: Well, and what's interesting in this kind of format is some of the other reality competition shows is they're all gamers or they're all super competitive, that they just wanna win all the things all the time.

Where this ... or this type of cast, um, in any traitor season is... Yes, they want to succeed and win in maybe their field, quote unquote, so to say, but they're not gamers. Maybe they're ambitious, but they're not gonna think the same. They're not gonna think the same kind of way that Rob is going to be thinking, and that just adds so many layers to, to this game.

Garrett: Yeah, definitely ... Love it. All right, well, let's [00:06:00] get into, well, they arrive.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: And start talking. And then, um, I think really the only thing that was interesting about that, or that was, uh, maybe out of the ordinary was Maura and Rob R um, she hadn't expected to see him there, apparently. She said,

Britney: Right.

Garrett: And, she expected him to stick with her, she said.

Britney: Which, and he was really sort of dismissive. And I know you're not gonna make alliances fresh out of the car, but it's just this kind of human nature. Oh my gosh, I know you. And to say something to lighten the mood or be social or you know, like she may have just been saying that to break the ice or to find some type of self comforting or something, you know? I mean, she didn't have to be serious about it, but he [00:07:00] was very, "Nah, we'll see." Dude, come on. Just pretend a little.

Garrett: Yeah,

Britney: Really?

Garrett: We did worry about him coming off as a little standoffish and maybe arrogant.

Britney: Yeah!

Garrett: Aloof. And it seems like he definitely playing to ... to form there.

Britney: Although some of his confessional.

Garrett: Yes.

Britney: Am I wearing clothes?

Garrett: Am I still wearing clothes? And I haven't kissed anyone yet.

Britney: Made me chuckle.

Garrett: Made me worry.

Britney: When did Traitors become a matchmaking show?

Garrett: Would be interesting. Um, especially you have to...If one of them is the traitor, that doesn't bode well for trust. Okay. Um, all right, so then, as you said, the, the selection of the Traitors, the, the fireworks, the theatrics of it, just, just one more level than [00:08:00] last season, just bringing even more, it was pretty exciting to watch that all happen.

Secret Traitor Twist

Garrett: Um, and then we get a new twist.

Britney: Right? That's got to throw everybody off guard. We're not expecting that.

Garrett: Yeah. So if you haven't watched the show, the episode, yet, um, spoilers from here on out. Um, but, uh, there is going to be a secret traitor who not only will the cast not know who they are, um, but we as an audience will not know who they are.

Britney: I don't, I don't like that. I don't like not knowing. It's very rude.

Garrett: It is very, very rude. Why do you think, other than just to bring something new and different, do you think there's any other ulterior motives with this, uh, from production or does it change the game in any way?

Britney: Oh, [00:09:00] absolutely. And what we'll see later, um, but of course you can't play the same game that you did season one. Your audience is going to get really tired of that. So it's gotta be bigger and better every single year, which we've seen in other shows that that's not always a good thing if, you know, sometimes people go off

Garrett: the rails.

Britney: Yeah. Um, there's, because it's now gotten to be so popular and people watch it and they know it and they get murder hungry and they want, they go in headstrong and wanna start playing that. I think they don't want the traitors to start going after each other so quick, like make it last a little longer. It could be a reason, I guess.

Garrett: Yeah, I think there's a little strategy for production in that.

[00:10:00] Um. To make it so the Traitors have to stick together a little bit longer at least.

Britney: It makes it interesting for sure.

Garrett: As well as just the whole ... craziness of it. And I think it has us talking about it and wondering and theorizing about who it might be and why. And so, and we'll get into that. So let's talk about the ones that really stood out for those that, you know, looked in the box, ... their reactions. Okay.

Britney: First off.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: I think the secret traitor is going to be someone they spent camera time on, because I just think that's what they're gonna do. Instead of the ones they kind of glazed over.

Garrett: Right.

Britney: A few of the people look like they were relieved. I think Ian looked relieved. Maybe Tara, I think she maybe looked relieved. I think they want to be faithfuls. Now whether [00:11:00] they're putting on that act ... like ... "Whew, I'm glad I'm not a traitor". And they really are. I don't know.

Garrett: Yeah, ... I think. So strategically wise, they didn't, this is, they're, this is new, right? So they don't have a lot of time to prep for this.

It's like immediately I just got here. Now we're picking a traitor and everybody is around.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: And so those who maybe aren't as gamer, um, used to being a gamer, may not have had any thought about how they were gonna play it at this point, so early, in front of everyone.

Britney: In front of everyone.

Garrett: Yeah. With blindfolds, blindfolds on... totally different story, but

Britney: mm-hmm.

Garrett: Now everybody else is looking at me when I'm getting chosen. So how do I act then?

Britney: And you don't know how a traitor would act or not act, so .... Yeah, like exactly what you said. What do you do in that moment? And then everybody else is judging every tiny little [00:12:00] nuance. Oh, you were super smiley. Well, I think a traitor isn't going to put on that big of a display, they're going to be more subtle and subdued, and their reaction is gonna be very, um, nonchalant.

Garrett: Unless it takes them completely by surprise, which you would hope they would've steeled themselves more. But yeah. So yeah, I would think you would want to be very .. not let anything out. Very poker face.

Britney: Yes, yes. If you have that skill, if you have a lot of people, I think everybody did a really good job at kind of being stoic and being well, except for maybe a few of 'em, but not giving too much away or showing what they wanted other people to see.

What I thought was interesting was some of the comments from everybody. [00:13:00] Standing in that group looking on. Right. You know, oh, so and so has one big brother. Oh, so and so I wanna stick by him.

Garrett: Right.

Britney: Um, they're already analyzing everything.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: And we don't even know who,

Garrett: Right.

Britney: you know.

Garrett: Exactly. We did get, I think it was Eric who said that he seemed to be playing, paying really close attention and analyzing really well.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Um. And, but he did say it was hard to see that far away where they were and to, like, and in the dark, uh, even with the lights. Right. So it'd be, it would be difficult to pick out facial expressions and, and so forth.

Britney: Yeah. You can't see anybody's eyes dilate, You can't see their pulse, pulsing.

Garrett: We get it, right? Like with the camera right there. But they don't that far away. um, and. And I think also later, maybe it was Kristen, Kristen who said that, [00:14:00] uh, you know, I was looking for stuff, but I don't know what I'm looking for. Like, are they different? Are they, I don't know. Right?

Britney: Is that a tell or is that who they are? Or if it is a tell, what are they trying to say?

This is why I can't play poker, because I know it's something, but I don't know what.

Garrett: Right? Yes, yes. Um, all right, so let's talk about, so Candiace was first, um, and she looked disappointed. ...

Britney: mm-hmm.

Garrett: Which we of course know she was not a secret traitor ... unless, crazy theory: What if she was, and she's one of the three, but also the secret traitor.

Britney: I can't. My brain can't think about that.

Garrett: So there's not really four, there's just three. Um,

Britney: that would be nutty.

Garrett: That's crazy. Yeah. So

Britney: she'd be playing it off really well.

Garrett: Yeah, that would be hard to do. But yeah, so she looked disappointed. [00:15:00] Um, we know she wasn't shown, she's not the secret traitor 'cause she gets chosen as a traitor and we'll get to that. But, um, she didn't hide... her expression very well for that. But she was also first.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Then came Donna.

Britney: Very stoic. Very held it together.

Garrett: Yeah. So impressed.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Nothing there. Um,

Britney: oh, and people picked up on that too. People saw that.

Garrett: They did. And they also picked on the, picked up on the, the Swifties are gonna kill you, if you go after her.

So, um, and then, uh, Yam Yam. He was third, at least according to what they showed us. We don't know what order they actually went in, but possibly that order. And he was, he smiled,

Britney: Yam Yam's always playing though.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: So I, he knew exactly what he was [00:16:00] doing. He put on a smile. Maybe ... If I keep this smile no matter what, then they can't read me.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: Rather than having subtle reactions, it's, I'm gonna keep it this way; and, Try and guess what I'm going through right now.

Garrett: So interesting that he had that. All right. The next one that, uh, interested me was, um, Tiffany.

Britney: Yes. Yes! Okay. So she closed her eyes, and I don't know (this again, this is why I can't play poker). She closed her eyes, which means something about something. But it ... like you're ... I don't know, but. I don't know if she was trying to be theatrical, if she was trying to be a certain way, and because [00:17:00] everybody puts on that little bit of drama in this game because they want to feel mysterious. And so I don't know if she was hiding, if she was having a reaction to being a traitor or not.

But, it was something, and that's what I came up with, all by myself.

Garrett: Not only did she close her eyes, she also looked away.

Britney: Yes!

Garrett: Slightly.

Britney: Yeah, she turned her head. I don't know if that was to hesitate, give her a moment. Hesitation to come up with a reaction?

Garrett: Yeah. It's interesting. Maybe. She, so she's obviously, we're thinking about the ones who are top of our list, who might be secret Traitors. And, uh, looking at their reactions to see if we can see anything. Um, she did say after that or he asked her and Alan asked her if she was, what she was feeling like and she said [00:18:00] she's ready to play. So definitely not a lot of, uh, nothing else there for us.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: There was also Rob R was then next and he gave no reaction either, so I was impressed with that.

Like he just kept a cold stone face. Um, we know that he also didn't see the card and so, you know, he didn't give away one way or the other. We couldn't really tell one.

Britney: Right. Yeah. He's very good at,

Garrett: so that was good of him, but I, you know, I kind of expect him to, to not give much of a reaction anyway, 'cause he's really quiet, so it's really good. Yeah.

Britney: If he can say stay consistent like that, then. He'll give nobody, or he won't give anybody any ammunition to call him out on anything.

Garrett: Yeah. So the next one isn't really on our list, but Ron was next. He had no reaction. Good job, but so fun. Uh, loved him bringing the, [00:19:00] the silliness and the funniness and the little comic relief for a tense moment with his, uh...

Britney: I want him to stay. I just feel like he's not going to.

Garrett: Yeah. Could be a short stint for him. Hopefully not. We want him to stay. Um, and then it go ... our next one though, uh, Natalie, she had a pretty big reaction, so -- relatively -- for her. Like what she didn't have, it wasn't stoic. It was, she blinked, her lips quirked a little bit, and she had slight smile.

Britney: Hmm.

Garrett: Like, like a, it wasn't, it wasn't a quirk, it was a, Hmm. Kind of quirk.

Britney: A wry smile?

Garrett: Maybe a wry smile. I don't know. You can read it anyway you want, I suppose. But it wasn't, it wasn't, wasn't a big smile. It was just a [00:20:00] Hmm. Smile like, Ooh, did I just do much too much maybe, or was it a. Ooh, I better make it a normal smile, fix my face.

Like maybe, oh, I broke that broke me and now I need to get back. So she's kind of, um, near the top of my list because of this crazy reaction.

Britney: But you're also,

Garrett: but she had half of the, she was 12th out of the 23, so she had 11 other people to like figure out how she wanted to react.

Britney: ...wants to. I ... and also, when you're up there facing the group, you're hyper conscious, consciously aware that they're staring back at you, and I think you're going to try to want to throw them off, right?

Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. She could be playing that next level.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: I want them to think. That I'm disappointed, maybe? It could have been a disappointed look, [00:21:00] it could also be a shocked, uh oh look. So it's hard. It was hard to read exactly. But um, and I'm not sure if she want, like, I don't remember hearing one way or the other, if she wants to be a faithful or a traitor.

Um, I think she'll play well, either ... way. But, um, that was interesting to me. Um, also kind of, uh. We didn't mention it before, but I'm not really sure how this is working from a production standpoint. Does ... I assume Alan knows who is going to be, um, if not chose the person, um, even before, you know, he's interviewed them or whatever. Um, and is he picking boxes? Do the boxes have their names on it? Like did he already have it prepared? And they're just bringing it up. Like is it any order that he figures out? We don't know.

Britney: They didn't show anything.

Garrett: They didn't really show [00:22:00] the ...

Britney: ... the boxes and like him, him grabbing the boxes from somebody and picking them up.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: And knowing

Garrett: we just see him grabbing,

Britney: or was it random?

Garrett: Right.

Britney: Does, you know, whoever got the box, got the box?

Garrett: Right. But we don't, yeah. And then does he know, like, does he look down and see if. But,

Britney: and then he's gotta fix his face. He can't let it out either, you know?

Garrett: Right. It's a good thing has his back to them.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Um, but yes, that was, that's also interesting just from a production and a how it works kind of perspective. It'll be interesting. I wonder if we'll get a, a more information about that eventually. Maybe there is, I haven't looked because I don't want any spoilers for this. Alright. Uh, Michael is, oh, not Michael. Um, it went to, oh, also interesting. Um, Natalie was the only, the second gamer and the only other one was Yam Yam who was third. So most of the gamers were in the last half of the [00:23:00] order that we were shown. So that's interesting. It gave them more time to potentially

Britney: figure out how they,

Garrett: figure out how they're gonna react. Right. Um, so very interesting.

Britney: That is interesting. I wonder if that was random or not.

Garrett: Well, we don't know, It definitely wasn't based on how they were standing. 'cause it, they were coming from different areas all, but, all right.

So next was that we wanna talk about, is Monét. Also fun! Uh, not probably on our list of secret traitor, but, um, just the, you know, "cold and a little tight" comment and

Britney: always has to make a comment. Always has to. Yeah.

Garrett: And, and bring up the, the challenge later with, from the, the boat with his whole thing with

Rob R. No, Colton. It was Colton. It was, [00:24:00] yeah. Yeah. Pluck plucking that out with his too fingers. Hawt! So good. So good. Loved it. Um, alright then it goes to the next one we wanted to talk about was, uh, Michael.

Britney: With that grin.

Garrett: Huge grin and a wink at Alan as he walked back,

Britney: I think that was showmanship.

Garrett: I think so too. I don't think he would be that

Britney: Obtuse...

Garrett: right. To think, oh, yeah. I, I don't think he, to be clear, I don't think he's the secret traitor, but it was very interesting and marked by several people about how loud he was with just everything.

Britney: And they're picking up on, oh, he must be a traitor. I'm like, Traitors are gonna be a lot more, well, good Traitors are gonna wanna hang back in the shadows and not draw [00:25:00] attention to themselves.

Garrett: In fact, somebody mentioned that later in the episode to um, Rob C. And Rob C was like, that is next level thinking. And I don't think that's where he's at. Uh, so he definitely has some really good thoughts and ideas about who might be a traitor and what's going on. And he has some strategic thinking in ways. Um, but I think his personality and or whatever it is, his character that he's playing. We don't, I don't know him personally. I don't know how he is with his friends, but this is potentially going to be an issue for him as we see throughout the episode.

Britney: Oh 100%. He's not gonna last long.

Garrett: Yeah. Alright, next, uh, is, was Ian,

Britney: he, he looked disappointed.

Garrett: He looked relieved actually. Oh, sorry. More than disappointed [00:26:00] because we know he wants to be faithful.

Britney: Yes.

Garrett: Or we learn it later, but at least. Um, we know he wants to be a faithful, and so his look of relief is potentially, I mean, he's smart enough to think many levels ahead and devious enough to think many levels ahead, but, um, it, it seemed genuine relief.

Okay. Relief because I want to be a faithful and Yeah. Um, and then Colton, who we know wants to be a traitor. Or learn later that wants to be a traitor. And he seemed disappointed also. And he's not necessarily a gamer. So may not have, even though he was almost last, may not had much of a prepared, how am I going react if it's me?

Britney: Well, you could go in with a game plan, I'm gonna react this way.

Garrett: But then you see it,

Britney: you see

Garrett: adrenaline goes up, heart rate. [00:27:00] And then finally, Rob C. Stone cold.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Simple nod. Said he was ready to play hard. Um, don't know. I mean, he is definitely near the top of my list for potentially really, really amazing secret traitor who would make crazy choices and amazing choices, but I don't honestly think that he actually is, but we'll see.

Britney: He's gonna be good at whatever he does.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: I would love to see him as a traitor.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: But he would be Faithful of the faithful, I think. He would be the traitor hunter.

Garrett: Yes, definitely.

Into the Castle

Britney: So after the choosing of the Secret Traitor, they all get together and, and talk, discuss, and...

Garrett: finally get to go into the castle.

Britney: Finally get...

Garrett: they're all excited to see all of the stuff.

Britney: And people are working. People are [00:28:00] talking and all already throwing out suspicions and I, what I caught on there was a few different things, but Yam Yam talking to Monét. Okay. Did you see Yam Yam, like, full on deflecting?

Garrett: Yes.

Britney: I thought that was so interesting. I don't know if I'm reading too much into it, but

Garrett: yeah, he's...

Britney: he was really trying to put the attention away from, from himself.

Garrett: Yes. And he seemed really awkward.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Maybe he is just awkward around Monét. I don't know. But yeah, very awkward looking. So obviously red flag as potentially the secret Traitor. Um. Or maybe just awkward in general. I don't know.

Britney: Maybe it was nothing. And [00:29:00] I am grasping at anything I can ...

Garrett: Right, exactly.

Britney: Get my hands on.

Garrett: I do also wanna point, errrr, out that same scene, we see Donna and Tiffany talking in the background.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: And they are, both, their legs are crossed, their arms are folded and they're talking, their chair's talking. But definitely very close body language like. I don't know you yet. I'm not, don't wanna give anything away. Does that mean they're also trying to hide something? 'cause that could mean that

Britney: that could mean that, or everybody has their guard up. Everybody's not wanting to be completely open and vulnerable.

Garrett: Mm-hmm.

Britney: Or maybe they were cold in. That was a comfortable way to sit.

Garrett: It is an old castle, who knows..

Britney: But, but good catch. Good catch on that.

Garrett: Yeah. Interesting about them. Pay attention to their body language in the future. Um, [00:30:00] also we see, uh, Colton talking with the group and to me he looked like he was a little guilty or looked like he was feeling guilty. Um, don't know what that's about. Maybe it's just how he always looks, but definitely seemed to like look away and not look at people in the eyes like he was being a little shifty there.

Britney: I see that.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: And maybe that was just a trust thing, too.

Garrett: Could be. Yeah.

Britney: Or awkward around people.

Garrett: Yeah, could be. And then finally, Monét, who not necessarily, again, not on my list of potential secret Traitors. Already starting to look for alliances. Um, I know people are talking about it, but like actively trying to work on alliances.

Britney: Do you think that works in this game this early on?

Garrett: I'm not sure. I mean, I can imagine that he talked or they've talked with Bob about it quite a bit.

Britney: [00:31:00] Sure.

Garrett: And maybe they believe that that's the best way to go. Um, I don't. At this point, there's only one person who's potentially a Traitor. So making alliances seems a little premature, but also less, potentially suspect, less sus.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: For, um, ulterior motives.

Britney: Didn't Yam Yam say something like, that's how he won... Survivor was... Making alliances and switching 'em and looking out for number one. And I think he says that later. Um, but someone's offering you an alliance. What are you gonna do? Say no?

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: And then get killed. No.

Garrett: Always say yes.

Britney: Always say yes to an alliance. Um, um, and have safety now. If you have to pivot later, [00:32:00] pivot later. I see nothing wrong with that.

Garrett: Yeah, exactly. So the next, uh, part that we wanted to move to was the, we get some, um, interviews with Alan. We get to see some of those interviews that he's doing. The ones that stood out to us, we wanted to talk about first. Ian. So we mentioned before the Faithful ... Wanted to be a Faithful. I thought it was interesting he said, "The faithful side of the game is a juicy net waiting to be cracked and solved."

Britney: He's really wanting to solidify he wants to be a faithful.

Garrett: Yes, definitely. How do you think, or why do you think he is so interested in the faithful side?

Britney: Oh, good question.

Garrett: Because obviously you have less information, which is, might be the nut part of it, the juicy nut part that he's talking about, but you have less information. You're trying to figure things out, but you also don't have to lie, necessarily, to people? [00:33:00]

Britney: Well, I think Ian's good at maneuvering and needing to switch when he needs to switch and zig when he needs to zig and zags when he needs to zag. Maybe he feels that he would be stronger at picking up on who the traitor might be rather than making bonds and having to kill. But maybe he's really good at that. 'cause I have seen him do that with his Big Brother, um, runs that he did. That's an interesting observation. I don't know. I think just people are more drawn to, I think more drawn to traitor. But unless you think that you can read people and figure it out, and maybe there's safety in numbers.

Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. And if you are a shield for everyone, you're a [00:34:00] shield.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: You're less likely to get taken.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Um, and then the last one was Donna. So I picked up on her saying, I think I can be ruthless. Now if we think that she is a secret traitor may indicate a little bit of. Uh, maybe hesitancy or self doubt about this new thing because at this point she would know what was happening. Uh, and so, uh, but then she, you know, follows it with, you know, gonna step up and I'll do this and I'll ... I'll be murdering if you ask me in murder. Um,

Britney: so she wasn't really saying what she wanted to be.

Garrett: Yeah. We don't hear that one way or the other.

Britney: Right. But, but that she'd be willing to do the Traitor, the dirty job that a Traitor needs to do.

Garrett: But if she was already the Traitor, she wouldn't be saying what she wanted to be. 'cause she already is. And [00:35:00] so maybe that's why we don't get it.

Britney: That's true too. Oh, I hope she is.

Garrett: That would be interesting.

Britney: Yeah.

Selection of the Traitors

Garrett: Very, very interesting. Um, um, then ... All right, I think that was all from that, that section, um, of, of the day. So then we get to the actual choosing of the rest of the Traitors around the round table. Um, we know that it's Candiace, Lisa, and Rob R.

Britney: Called it, who called it? I knew it was gonna be Lisa.

Garrett: Yes. You got one right. I got zero out of, zero out of five.

I had on my list. Um, but yes. Um, but I find it interesting. Uh, two housewives,

Britney: Two housewives! What and, and why and what?!?

Garrett: I mean, maybe there's a little in Alan's head about them getting picked off so [00:36:00] often and so early. Uh, maybe they just seem less likely to be traitors and he wants to give them a fighting chance.

And no gamers unless it's of course a secret Traitor. But, um, yeah, Rob's not a gamer.

Britney: Is it too obvious that it would be a gamer? So that's why you didn't choose a gamer? Because I, well, I don't know who Secret Traitor is. I have my theories.

Garrett: We, we'll get to that,

Britney: but it, it was such, I was floored at these nomin.... and then Rob, I don't, don't see him as a traitor. Okay. I should say he's not like the other Traitors that we've seen.

Garrett: Yes.

Britney: That I know of him and I know 12 minutes of airtime for him, so.

Garrett: Right. Um, he has some good qualities I think that [00:37:00] would, could work well for him. He is and always has been somebody who sits quietly in the back and kinda watches and takes in and pays attention to what's going on around him. So

Britney: this is actually a really solid Traitor characteristic.

Garrett: Solid Traitor, which is maybe why he's chosen. I don't know that his interview with Alan was anything spectacular or amazing. Um,

Britney: So yeah, I wonder why he was chosen.

Garrett: So, but maybe that just fact that he, and he, you know, he's a charmer in a way. Um. And he also can be pretty ruthless with the snake hunting and the stuff like that and the quietness. So I wonder if all of that has something.

Britney: So he's a different kind of traitor than we've seen, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's gonna be a ... bad Traitor. I think he might be actually really good,

Garrett: potentially could work out for him. Um, especially in contrast to the other two who were a little more extreme. Um.[00:38:00]

Britney: Little more loud.

Garrett: A little more loud. Definitely he, he'll be kind of playing, playing the middle or the low end of things. I think

Britney: it'll be interesting to see who's running the turret.

Garrett: Yes.

Britney: Who's gonna be top dog Traitor?

Garrett: I mean, it seems it's Lisa.

Britney: Yes. Although Candiace,

Garrett: she's,

Britney: she's, she speaks up

Garrett: doing all sorts of stuff out of the blue. Um. Uh, we'll talk about with, well, let's just talk about it now. Later. She, um, talks, she brings up, or before they get picked, um, she brings up Lisa's name and in conversation is this, she'd make a great Traitor, like before she even knows who her fellow Traitors are,

Britney: right?

Garrett: So she, she knows she's a Traitor, but she doesn't know anybody else is, and she brings up Lisa. So a housewife already going against a housewife, but then also just being [00:39:00] that bold to, to bring,

Britney: To be calling people out when you don't even know who your other traitors are.

Garrett: Her, her reasoning was that she believes that's what Faithful are going to do or are doing. And I think there is some truth to that.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Um, but I think they are a little more ... in general, a faithful is a little bit more ... calm about it or less open about it, maybe throwing a few names or this not being as ... this person would make a great traitor. No, don't do that. Um, and, and then of course,

Britney: She'd have the support from the other housewives though, so ....

Garrett: Oh, yeah. Right.

Britney: So that I, it was a conversation to be had, maybe just not right now.

Garrett: Right. Exactly before she knew. Um, and in the tower later on, you know, she, uh, owns up to the fact that she did it, which is [00:40:00] good. Uh,

Britney: do you think that she'll ...

Garrett: I think, uh, because it probably would've come back to bite her if she hadn't, but she says she's going to fix it.

Britney: And whether that's lip service or not, you know, we don't know if she's actually going to fix it or not, or just, let people sit and stew on it a little bit as long as she has to.

Garrett: Right? So she may be using that to her advantage later. We'll see. Um, I don't know. I think we don't see her do anything about it in later in the episode or anything. So there's a couple car rides and stuff, so that doesn't, none of that comes up. So, hmmm. And... Anything else about our group of Traitors?

Britney: I wanna see 'em work. I wanna see how well they're gonna work together and how the secret [00:41:00] Traitor's gonna come into play with everything, which we will get into. Yes.

Garrett: Yes. We'll get into that more. I do wanna bring up, not necessarily about the picking itself, but afterwards, Rob C, when everybody takes off their blindfolds.

Britney: Yes. We're still at the round table. He's really good at, yeah. Making sure that he wants to scope everybody out and he knows that he wants people to see him looking around who might be the traitor

Garrett: Right.

Britney: Without drawing attention to himself.

Garrett: Exactly. Yeah. So I don't know how well he did. Nobody, we don't get any, any, uh, pointers that it was odd or anything, but, uh.

Britney: But that's gotta be going through your head. Yeah, that's got to,

Garrett: If it was me ...

Britney: an added paranoia back of who is it? Do I see anything? Also, what am I doing? What am I doing with my face? What am I doing with my body? What am I doing with the energy I'm emitting? [00:42:00] Does anybody suspect me? But wait, I'm not a traitor, so,

Garrett: so it doesn't matter.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: I don't wanna be thought as this one.

Britney: Don't wanna be thought of one. And people will ... choose anything. Oh, you, you breathe differently than you normally do. You've met me for 12 hours. You go, you know, or any slight slightness that they could, they could find that they're gonna latch onto 'cause they don't have any information right now.

You moved your chair. Well, I was uncomfortable. You must be a traitor.

Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. You latch onto anything you can

Britney: mm-hmm.

Garrett: Regardless of how actual reality of, um, and I, I think if it was me having, perhaps staring at me, I feel like he's looking at my soul and I cannot hide anything. He knows everything when he looks into my eyes like that.

Britney: Yeah.

Nightcaps and Convos

Garrett: So, uh, crazy. All right, so then they go directly to nightcap. [00:43:00]

Britney: Mm-hmm. Oh, oh, Lisa, she tied her nerves. She played off pretty well though.

Garrett: She did. Yes. So she was, that was with Ian and Tiffany.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: So they at least saw that and, and she did seem to play it off really well, and we didn't see anything later on. Nobody, I think they mentioned it in the moment, but nobody replayed that or said anything about that later on in the episode.

Britney: So they kind of forgot about it. Or at least what we saw.

Garrett: We'll see if it comes up at that round table when that actually happens. Sure. Or when people might bring that up.

Britney: That would be good evidence. You know, at least good ammo, right. To use against somebody.

Garrett: Yes. Which is also interesting now that I say that, like we did not get in this episode a murder or a round table.

Britney: I was disappointed.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: But there was a lot going on.

Garrett: There was a lot going on, especially the starting at night. So you have, I mean, you have sleep in there, uh, happening, [00:44:00] so

Britney: that's true.

Garrett: Uh, but it was very interesting for a first episode. All right, so Lisa, and then we have, um, Natalie who comes in hot!

Britney: Yes, yes. She was just like, look into my eyes. I am not a traitor. I am faithful

Garrett: and I am going to play the aggressive faithful game. Yeah. What are your thoughts about that strategy? Because I think we can be pretty sure she is a faithful from that, not a secret traitor, because that is in several levels higher thinking. If you are. But

Britney: if you are, I would, I feel like I would initially think it would be over the top and too much and somebody trying to put up, um, a, a shield of I am, I am not a traitor. I would think it would be way too [00:45:00] aggressive, but that's just maybe me and my personality. Um, also knowing that, okay, Traitors aren't necessarily going to behave that way.

They're going to hopefully let other people be at the forefront and make the noise and let them take each other out. I, I personally thought it was well aggressive, which that was her goal. I'll see if it works for her.

Garrett: It definitely makes you more out there for the traitors.

Britney: Yes.

Garrett: As a potential threat or worry.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: As opposed to playing like the middle game.

Britney: And why would that? I'm gonna be an aggressive Faithful. Okay. You're out.

Garrett: Right. That would be one of my first choices.

Britney: She's so strong, though.

Garrett: Yeah. Yeah, so challenge wise, maybe she's, I mean, this isn't like survivor where you can [00:46:00] hope to win immunity kind of thing. Yeah.

But there are shields to be won. There are in the past at least, and there are, you know, ways to, to protect yourself. So maybe, maybe she's hoping for some of that.

Britney: Let's hope so.

Garrett: Yeah, I hope so. I want her to stay in.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Um, and see this aggressive play, what that looks like. Um,

Britney: Faithful of the faithful.

Garrett: Yeah. All right. Then we get, uh, Michael, who I think, um, well, he talks about that mathematically or statistically speaking because there are five housewives and five players or gamers, um, that it's likely that one of each could be a Traitor. Which is a good thinking and actually how I was trying to choose my group, but it didn't go well for me.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: But numbers wise, but numbers wise, it seems likely.

Britney: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Garrett: So, and it would be right as far as housewives go, in fact there's two of 'em. [00:47:00] But uh, that comment then is used as fuel in later conversations, and we can get to that then or now if you want....

Britney: brought up by a housewife because he was the one calling out. Would it? I mean, if you're talking to a group of faithfuls who are wanting to catch traitors, it's sound logic, I think. Yeah. I mean, that's where I would've gone.

Garrett: That's

Britney: where I would've said too. Yeah, exactly.

Garrett: Sure. Mm-hmm.

Britney: But it's also something that can be used against you, and

Garrett: especially since he's such a Bravo, such a housewives fan, and wanting to get in part of that, or we thought maybe he would want to be part of that alliance. But that doesn't necessarily endear you to them.

Britney: No. Which they could have pulled him, pulled him into their alliance with that, and so I think it was not [00:48:00] very smart that he called it out like that so quickly.

Garrett: Right. Or too. I don't know how big the group was. I can't remember. But yeah, definitely smart, uh, analysis, but maybe not the best of

Britney: timing.

Garrett: Timing. Yeah. Uh, and then we get, uh, Candiace, uh, we already talked about that, um, and putting Lisa's name out. And then, uh, the, the night ends with Tiffany and Rob C having a short, very, very short conversation. About starting a gamer alliance. Yes. What's interesting to me about that is we see in when they first get there in the car ride or after the car ride, as they're all mingling that we see Rob say that he knows who Tiffany is and that she's a. Big brother legend and that he would love to work with her and have an alliance with her. Right.

Britney: So when the opportunity is presented to him,

Garrett: you would think, I mean, he does say yes here, of [00:49:00] course. I mean, 'cause he knows you always say yes, but it doesn't seem like he's enthusiastic about it. It doesn't seem like he wants to talk about it. I mean, he, in the, the next day in the challenge, he wants to sit and talk about where we're gonna put the, the coffin and so. It seems odd that he has switched.

Britney: There's a lot of back and forth now that I remember. Was it in the, um, kind of foyer area

Garrett: going up, like right before they're heading up stairs? Like they, he walks up the stairs after that, or they both do.

Britney: I wonder what doors are open.

Garrett: We don't

Britney: who, who hear what and so it is maybe like a, a quick handoff, wanna be an alliance? Cool. Solid. And then nobody suspects anything. They didn't see you talking,

Garrett: right?

Britney: Like just a quick handshake?

Garrett: Could be. Could be, but it does raise some suspicions for me about him. [00:50:00] Maybe.

Britney: Well, you just don't know where his thinking is at now.

Garrett: Right? You don't know where it is. And the quickness of it.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Kind of just putting her off, but maybe they're on a deadline to get up the stairs, to get in their rooms, maybe.

They, it's been edited in a way that it looks like that, I don't know.

Britney: We don't know. There's so much we don't know.

Garrett: But we're just bringing this up so that we can, when we're right later, we won't bring it up if we're wrong. If it doesn't matter. But just wanted to, to, to catch that. All right, so that takes us to the, the tower and the. The experience of them meeting each other. Um, we already talked a lot about that. Is there anything else you wanted to talk about the, the group in the tower?

Traitor Tower Meetup

Britney: No. Um, it was just, you know, the girls were excited to, to see each other.

Garrett: Yeah. And Rob was definitely [00:51:00] less, um, enthused or at least just less displaying emotions.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Um. And, uh,

Britney: they were also surprised that there were two housewives.

Garrett: They were as well. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that they will work well together or they seem to work well together. So far.

Britney: I think

Garrett: ... with everything...

Britney: I think they'll stick with each other for at least a little bit. They'll gonna want stick their, uh, or keep their, um, Housewives alliance as strong as possible. So I don't think they're gonna be turning on each other at least anytime too soon.

Garrett: Do you think they'll turn on Rob?

Britney: Yeah,

Garrett: Maybe. We'll see what happens. All right, so then we also get an image of the secret Traitor.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Red robe, walking through the hall, whatever arm holding a lantern. What are your thoughts?

Britney: I think it's a woman.

Garrett: Okay.

Britney: I think as a woman traitor, especially later, when we see [00:52:00] her writing, the names on the, the document, the scroll, the whatever, but. The way that she's holding the lantern, I thought was more feminine. Small wrist. I don't know how a man would hold a lantern or I can't remember at the time, I'll have to rewatch

Garrett: With muscles...

Britney: he is holding it way up here. Um, I, it just seemed very feminine to me, but three female traitors.

Garrett: Yeah, that does seem a little odd. But also unexpected.

Britney: Keeps us on our toes,

Garrett: right? Yeah. So, and

Britney: I think it's Donna

Garrett: and you think it's Donna. All right,

Britney: I'll say that again later.

Garrett: We'll say it later. All right. Um, and then they learn when Alan comes in, the turret that the secret Traitor will make [00:53:00] a short list of names to get to them to choose.

This totally changes the game that the traitors can play.

Britney: Yeah. It takes away their power. And I think they said that, that they have less control over who they get to choose, which, um, puts a damper, a barrier in their own personal game and who they want to make alliances with, who they think is strong, who they wanna keep around. I think it's a, a severe disadvantage.

Garrett: Exactly. And, and they are not happy about it either. But it is, it is interesting and I think because the secret Traitor doesn't know who they are either, um, it could make for some very wild episodes. Like we get, um. With, uh, Rob's name later on.

Britney: Yeah, he made the short list.

Garrett: Being on the short list. Right. [00:54:00] Which makes their job so then they only have three to choose instead of four. So it narrows it down even more. I guess it makes it a little easier for us to figure out maybe who they're going to choose out of that list.

Britney: That's true.

Garrett: Um, and so we get that. 'cause usually we're left wondering who they're gonna pick. I mean, we still are, but uh. It is. They talk about several different names, but we don't necessarily know. Were there other names ... they are discuss ... they discuss?, are there other things they talked about that we just didn't know? We usually get it after the fact.

Britney: Sure.

Garrett: But, uh, usually we just hear a few names and reasons as they're going through different people. And so,

Britney: but they have reasons for that. This is just somebody else picked them for us,

Garrett: right? And so they have to manufacture reasons or figure out how will it look for me, for us, uh, and will we, you know, how can we play this now? Um, [00:55:00] so they have a little bit of say with the challenge, which we'll get to, but uh, it's not as cut and dried as they might have hoped.

First Mission - Graveyard and Coffins

Britney: Well, let's talk about the challenge. Are we to the challenge yet?

Garrett: Alright, yeah. That's where we're at. That's where they go next. First Mission. The coffins. They gotta give the money into the graves, basically.

Britney: That's, that's as many coffins in a short amount of time. So there's not a lot of quick thinking strategy, especially for the maybe non strategists, the non-gamers, um, which of course that we heard Rob C say, but it's drop it in the closest one.

Garrett: Yeah, that was a lot of 'em. So let's kind of go through. What the reasoning was given for each of them and so forth. Um, I did think as we talk about strategy, um, Rob R says his strategy in general is to be valuable in the challenges, right? So that people won't wonder, well, [00:56:00] why is he still here?

Britney: Smart.

Garrett: Um, which is smart. Yeah. So that is where he's going and we'll see how all that works because it doesn't always work. A lot of people get cut regardless of how ... get banished at least, and even murdered. Regardless of how they perform in challenges, it doesn't seem to be as big a reason. So I wonder how many, how much of Traitors he's actually watched,

Britney: Which is weird,

Garrett: it seems like it could be a good reason. But then you think about,

Britney: but the Traitors want money in the pot too.

Garrett: They do.

Britney: So they would want to keep them around for at least a little bit?

Garrett: You would think so. But it doesn't ever really seem to play out that way. I mean, a little bit, but I don't know. I guess they just figure they'll make it up later or. I don't want them around to figure me out. Or maybe they're, it's less about what, how much money they can bring and more about other things.

Britney: Sure.

Garrett: Alright. Alright. So the first, the red boat really strong, they come in first and they fig-, they realize [00:57:00] that they have to drop this off. And so they say that their strategy will be to just drop it in whichever's closest, closest one, which happened to be Ron.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Um, and so that's what they do. We had talked about how Rob C was a little frustrated that they didn't wanna sit around and talk about this, but,

Britney: You're on a time crunch.

Garrett: But yeah, I don't know that that would've worked well unless it was a minute or less like

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: But how much can you have a conversation, a discussion, in a minute?

Britney: But especially with how, how many people, you know when everybody's gonna have a different opinion, you're gonna sit there waste time,

Garrett: right. So maybe not the best timing or idea. Uh, then the next, uh, one that gets a coffin is Rob R. And Colton is the one who says, let's put it in the first one. So closest, right? So they use the similar strategy, at least for this first time. Then, um, red comes back again and they put it in Eric's [00:58:00] Eric. In his grave and they say it's because he's really nice and doesn't need protecting.

Britney: Oh, no one's gonna banish him.

Garrett: Nobody's gonna banish him, or nobody's going to murder him 'cause this is about murder, right?

Britney: No one's gonna murder him.

Garrett: Right? They could banish him, but nobody's gonna murder him. He's too nice. Which seemed like odd reasoning. I don't know who said it. Um, but I think they all kind of agreed at least, and yeah, it didn't seem like the best strategy.

Britney: Forces the hand. Forces their agenda, um, to say, we want, we want this guy because

Garrett: Yeah. So it was a, it was an odd strategy, but Okay. Um, but they also didn't know that there's gonna be a short list and that, like they don't know any of that. So they just think any, it could be anyone, and then, but good strategy, Natalie.

They go back down to the docks and she says, let's make an alliance with [00:59:00] these idiots or fools, or, I can't remember what she said, but

Britney: that was, she was quick on her feet. That was good thinking. Like, let's team up. Let's go after the other one.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: But what we see later is what Green team had the same,

Garrett: yeah. So Green Team makes an alliance with, so green team has an alliance with red and white.

Britney: Yeah, let red and white go after each other.

Garrett: Exactly. So none of them get their, their graves or coffins in their graves. So yes, they were even smarter, like next level, like another level strategy. Um, I mean they all could have done it, I suppose, but then how do you make that work? The next one that gets it is, uh, you know, the green that came in is Michael. They put it in Michael's. Um, and. We don't really hear why. We don't get that.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: So it seemed like it might have been kind of close. Um, and that was their reasoning for the first one they did. [01:00:00] So maybe it was about closeness. Uh,

Britney: But also, I mean, he is very abrasive and

Garrett: could be that

Britney: very loud and

Garrett: Yeah. And it said

Britney: maybe it was the

Garrett: housewives could be a Traitor or the gamers like, could have been any of those things.

So. Um, the white boat comes in, you know, they made the, uh, they come in and then Michael gets really upset and takes this very personally that some people are targeting him.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Um, seemed a little over the top, but he's also kind of over the top sometimes. So that's him it seems like. Um, and it's actually Ron who suggested a housewife's grave.

Britney: And candiace knows that.

Garrett: And Candiace knows that, although she wasn't in that group, she knows that he had targeted, so Candiace was there when he said that. 'cause Candiace,

Britney: Candiace said,

Garrett: oh, wait, no, she was,

Britney: yeah, yeah.

Garrett: So she says no housewives, [01:01:00] but,

Britney: but later she was like, Hey, there's already some fodder on Michael. I'm just going to blow that up a little more.

Garrett: Right.

Britney: You know?

Garrett: Exactly. So, um. They then almost put it in Rob C's grave.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: Like it's almost going in. And then they kind of changed their mind and they choose Donna. And that was Candiace.

Britney: That was Candiace. So that I think is what she said is if you, she may think that she's not gonna do well in the competition. So, you know, trample the weak and.

Garrett: Maybe

Britney: right. And

Garrett: or maybe she is worried about

Britney: and cut them while they cut the weak. I don't think she's gonna be weak.

Garrett: No. Maybe she's worried about her potential popularity though, and her faithfulness or her ability to make a lot of friends and alliances

Britney: or influence over other people.

Garrett: It could be that we don't know, [01:02:00] but there's something there. Then we see Eric and Ron now finally see that they have coffins in their graves and also take it personally, but not in a personally, but that someone hates them way, like this is why they would do that, which I found interesting from a psychological perspective.

Like the only reason, it's a a logical fallacy, but the only reason they would choose me is because. They don't like me.

Britney: And that has a lot to do with maybe insecurities. That has a lot to do with your initial reaction to, you know, your body's going into that, you know, fight or flight mode when you're already rushing.

So it's already heightened, you're already working hard. You're so, your body's already at an elevated, um, uh, stance in uh position. And so it's feeding that it's feeding. Um. [01:03:00] Your fight or flight nervous system already and that's going to be your reaction when you feel threatened is blame.

Garrett: I don't blame them. I would probably feel threatened too, but

Britney: Especially when you don't have time to sit and think why. All you see is a coffin is in my grave. I feel threatened

Garrett: now I might murdered

Britney: and now I might be murdered before you have a minute to take a deep breath and process it.

Garrett: All right, so let's move on to, uh, green, um, and white making the alliance. And then Rob C gets a coffin. So, uh, we don't really get much about why that was chosen. Um, but that's who was. And then Ian, we also don't know. And then Mark, who we do know was kind of far away. But [01:04:00] they had to and go farther to do it. So whoever it was took it where,

Britney: and it could be that he was just not in the boat.

Garrett: Exactly. They had to choose and not in a boat. And that's who they saw.

That's what they did.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Um, um, wasn't part of his alliance group.

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Uh, and the white almost made, didn't make it back. Didn't make it back in time. So they don't get their 10th one. So all those people are up for murder and the car ride back afterwards.

Drama Starts in the Car Ride

Britney: That creates some drama that's where Candiace starts...

Garrett: some drama starts

Britney: Feeding the fodder.

Garrett: Let's, let's talk about that drama.

Britney: So, so she, she clearly knows it wasn't Michael, that. That said, let's target the housewives. She does know that he mentioned it earlier, which was her being misleading to the [01:05:00] other women in the car. So how real is that? Maybe it's authentic, but I mean, she's definitely playing the game. She's definitely trying to plant seeds. I think. It's. She's playing too hard?

Garrett: Yeah, she has a confessional where she says she's actually, she did it to kind of create some,

Britney: yeah,

Garrett: some noise around him. Um,

Britney: sprinkling down to a lot of different people. I'm gonna hyperfocus on one and try to draw attention to that person, um, to get, to get it. It just happens. I think maybe they would've liked to bring him into his alliance, but hey, if the opportunity is there, we might as well go with it.

Garrett: Could be...

Britney: But as we see later....

Garrett: Doesn't work out for her.

Britney: No, no.

Garrett: Um, however, she does have a really quick comeback and does not like stutter or stammer or, so it doesn't look as

Britney: can we talk about gaslighting much?

Garrett: Suspicious. [01:06:00] Of course, of course. You're experts at having been gas lit

Britney: and that, and then poor Porsha now is discredited because Maura was like, I don't remember whether that's true or not, or she's just doesn't want the spotlight on her, but now it is, maybe she has to pick sides, but if she doesn't really know, and so now does it make Porsha think that, oh, she's starting drama and throw names and throwing housewives, you know, sisterhood underneath the bus when she was, you know, she starts trying to figure out what happened. And Candiace was quick to deflect, but it was super sus like she was quick and we see Michael just took the attention to On him.

Garrett: Yeah.

Britney: And away from that situation.

Garrett: Yeah. We were talking earlier, before we started recording, I mentioned how it is [01:07:00] interesting that his reaction, his. Attitude and just demeanor, uh, and loudness. Um, kind of dis- distracted from the fact that they kind of just caught Candiace in a lie. But because of him and how he was going about it, nobody was paying attention to that anymore. Like, it, it went,

Britney: he saved her.

Garrett: He kind of saved her.

Britney: Unknowingly. Yeah, granted,

Garrett: right? Like unknowingly and, and so. Interesting.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: She's kinda lucky that one was a, almost got her.

Britney: I wanna see if that comes back into play. I wanna see if there's any comeback from that. If Porsha is now, um, super sketched out from Candiace and that trust is gone and if it divides the Housewives at all, or if it just gets,

Garrett: Porsha does say that, well, she's my [01:08:00] sister. And,

Britney: okay, I'm sorry. In the game of Traitors, you have no sisters. You have no sisterhood. You have no brotherhood.

Garrett: Have no brothers, moms, or dads or siblings.

Britney: You have to slice a bitch like if you have to. Then if they're coming after me, I'm not gonna be like, oh my gosh, but we're sisters. It's okay if you murder me, it's okay. No, you are not going to do that.

You have to be wary of everybody because that person could kill you. I think it's

Garrett: You want the alliances, but you don't ... trust

Britney: If you're besties with a traitor, they will take you as far as they, because they know you're a vote to keep them. Exactly. They will murder you though,

Garrett: or take you in to the very end.

Britney: And cut you there and totally blindside....

Garrett: you realize that you're blindsi- yeah. That they were [01:09:00] a traitor all along and you get nothing and they get everything. Yeah.

Britney: Yeah. There are no sisterhoods when it comes because no matter what they, they're going to stab you in the back, whether it's at while you're sleeping or whether it is at the final banishment.

Garrett: Right.

Britney: I'm just saying. Okay. Off my soapbox for right now.

Murder Shortlist

Garrett: Alright, sounds good. We're almost done. So we get the shortlist from the Secret Traitor from the dungeon. It goes up to the Traitors in the tower. Shortlist is Rob R, Ian, Mark, and Eric.

Britney: Oh, I'm sorry. Who is that? Eric? Did I not say Eric was going to be the first one murdered? I think I did.

Garrett: You did. Um, and, and that is the next question. Who was chosen for murder out of those? I think it's gonna be Eric. [01:10:00]

Britney: I think it's gonna be Eric.

Garrett: Yeah. Definitely. To me he seemed kind of like a deer in a headlights.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: Um,

Britney: no one's It's gonna get mad.

Garrett: Yeah. Very safe. Doesn't blow back on any of them. In any way

Britney: I get attached to these people and then they die..

Garrett: I know. Very sad. Um, they, it is interesting though. So of course the Traitors don't like this. They have to choose and they're also a little mad, or at least Rob R is mad, about his name being on list, but they don't know who that you were a Traitor, so, okay. If it just makes your job a little easier and you're safe,

Britney: they're all men.

Garrett: Yes. So your theory about a woman could be interesting, could play that, or maybe it's a guy who wants to get rid of other competition.

Britney: So I was thinking, and I know we're gonna ask predictions later, but if it is Donna who raised football players, do you think that she would be more [01:11:00] comfortable with big, strong men around her?

Garrett: You would think so. Or at least not intimidated by it or,

Britney: right. And so he is a big, strong guy, but the other three are not.

Garrett: Right.

Britney: And so I was thinking like at first, might, oh, it's Donna. Because she's not targeting the big

Garrett: To be fair, Mark is strong.

Britney: He is. That's true. He's not a big football linebacker strong. But I was wondering that, but her throwing in Rob R kind of made me wonder if my theory held any water or not, but it did cross my mind.

Garrett: Yes. They're of course wondering why Michael's not on the list. Which... could the secret traitor be Michael, and playing a crazy double triple?

Britney: Well, the smart traitors know that he's probably gonna get banished. So why waste a murder if he's just gonna get voted out?

Garrett: Which is why I thought it was odd that [01:12:00] they thought it was odd that his name wasn't on the list. Like of course, it's not gonna be on the list, you may not want him in the game because you don't enjoy playing with him or whatever, but. You'd let that happen through banishment.

Britney: Exactly. So you can get two birds out with one stone instead of waste one, so,

Garrett: exactly. Yeah. Um, and then Rob says he thinks the handwriting looks like Yam Yam's.

Britney: How does he know?

Garrett: I don't know. He's a handwriting expert. He knows how snakes and he knows handwriting. I don't know, but he does say, um, I mean, it is definitely not. Cursive, flowery, whatever writing that we see.

Britney: I mean, I would disguise mine....

Garrett: I would disguise my handwriting too. Yeah.

Britney: I don't know how often they're writing notes to each other in that castle, but maybe you don't want it looking like a woman. Maybe you don't like it, want it looking like a man. So maybe you're writing it with your left hand instead of your right, I don't know. But I did think it was still. A feminine [01:13:00] handwriting. Well, how she was holding the pencil and, and through the gloved hand, I still thought it was feminine. If it's a man, I'm sorry,

Garrett: Johnny ... we got ... I mean, even Eric, although he wouldn't have put his name on it, so it can't be him, because, yeah, the secret traitor's not gonna put their name on, of course, on the short list, because then they could get murdered.

Britney: Or or not get, well, not get murdered and then everybody's gonna wonder why there was no murder.

Garrett: Right. Will that happen, I don't know. Anyway, I,

Britney: yeah,

Garrett: I would assume that if a shortlist means that none of them, not Ian, Mark, nor Eric are the secret traitor, I would assume that. So we at least know that at this point.

Britney: Yes. Yes.

Garrett: It could be one of the ones who was up for murder.

Britney: Yes. You could put yourself

Garrett: The other five maybe.

Britney: But you're not gonna put yourself on the short list.

Predictions

Garrett: You're not gonna put the short list. Okay. So brings us to who is the secret [01:14:00] Traitor?

Britney: Donna.

Garrett: That was quick.

Britney: I think Tara might be a fun one. But that would still be three women, which it's not unheard of, but I don't think they would do that right off the bat. I think if you're gonna have all one sex, it's going to be through recruitment or just by happenstance, you know, happenstance to have that b--

Garrett: It's a very even group.

Britney: Yeah.

Garrett: So my vote/guess is Yam Yam.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: I believe Rob's handwriting expertise, uh, prowess, handwriting. Analyst.

Britney: He would be a good one actually.

Garrett: I think he would be really good. And I think the being one of the first to be shown as a reaction. One of the first players to be shown, one of his smiling one.

So he may not have. It is still a good, a good response. Doesn't give a lot away, but it's also not the stoic thing that maybe he might have done if he had more time [01:15:00] to think about it.

Britney: But even, even if you are smiling, you're still throwing people off. He's, people still aren't reading you very well, you know?

Garrett: But then he is not, when he is talking with Monét and very looking guilty and a little like deflecting and stuff like that. So that's kind of on my, on my radar

Britney: I've been trying to look at people's hands because I also thought I saw through the black gloved hand was a ring on. I thought I saw the middle finger, but I didn't see anybody's hands. But you know what I actually like Yam Yam for, for the Traitor.

Garrett: I will also say it could just be a production, it could be an actor pretending to be the traitor.

Britney: No, I don't think so. That's not a thing. I don't think. It's the actual traitor because that's what they've always done before. Now when, um, Alan was like doing, the do you solemnly swear to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

He was clearly doing that to a camera and not to an actual person. [01:16:00] But I do think walking around with a red cloak and stuff, I do think that's the, was the actual Traitor. I could be wrong, but

Garrett: I know. Yeah. Who knows? Probably I've never been wrong before. So. Alright, so finally we didn't get a banishment or murder, so we already said who we think is gonna be murdered. Banished. Who do you think is going to be banished?

Britney: Oh, Michael.

Garrett: Yeah, you're still thinking Michael?.

Britney: Yeah. I was thinking Lisa or Michael, but I think Lisa's going to kind of step back a little bit and not be so in your face, I think she's gonna play it, play it a little smarter.

Garrett: Okay. And I'm sticking with Michael or Ian.

Britney: Mm-hmm.

Garrett: So, assuming that he doesn't get murdered,

Britney: I mean, Michael's just stepping in it, he's just setting himself up for failure.

Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. My Ian one is more just because he is the threat and people might

Britney: Right.

Garrett: Might, uh, worry about that, but he doesn't seem [01:17:00] to be as calculating, or as, as faithful about it as say, Rob C.

Britney: Sure. Yep.

Garrett: All right.

Britney: Good discussion.

Garrett: Yeah, good job. Way to go.

Britney: Way to go. That was fun. Um, I'm excited for, for what's to come for the,

Garrett: yeah,

Britney: I think it's gonna be,

Garrett: I think we're gonna get, I mean, we don't, I didn't have it before. I didn't write it down, but do you think we're gonna get just a banishment and a murder next episode, or do you think we're gonna get like.

Britney: I think we'll get both.

Garrett: You think we'll end with maybe them having another list to choose from, or do you think it's just going to be the banishment?

Britney: Oh, I, oh, I would think that they would have a competition first, but usually they do a murder in the, I don't know what they're gonna do.

I think we'll definitely have the, um, I don't know how they're gonna play the short list now. I maybe. They'll just come up with four [01:18:00] random people instead of the, which ones have like quote unquote the shield.

Garrett: Depending on what is the, the competition.

Britney: Right, right. I wonder how that's going to change, if it's gonna be the same, well, not four people, maybe we say three people, or if things are gonna happen and it's gonna be completely different people and how that's going to be, you know, the. The Traitors are gonna wonder what they're thinking. What the secret Traitor's thinking is is gonna be when it's just chaos and all over the place and there's no rhyme or reason.

Garrett: Right. How hard would it be to have only, I mean, it could be easy. You don't have to worry about convincing anybody else, but you don't have all the information potentially that you need to make a choice of all four of the four to choose.

Britney: And the wonder why thing, because like we said, it's not gonna be. My four people that I want to get rid of.

Garrett: Exactly. Yeah. So they, whatever that [01:19:00] person's agenda is or their group that Yeah,

Britney: they're doing the secret Traitor's bidding.

Garrett: Yeah. All right. Well I think that's it for this week. See us next time. Where we gonna talk about episode two. Um, go to the socials and let us know what you think.

Britney: Let us know what you think and your opinions and your thoughts and who your predictions.

Garrett: Awesome. Well, that's,

Britney: that's checkmate.

Garrett: checkmate.

Wanna keep the conversation going? Join us on social media and tell us how you would play it.

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